Manchester United Message Board
So here we go again English supporters blamed once more.
William Gaillard blames the Liverpool fans for the apparent trouble last night when genuine fans with tickets were refused entry.
This rings a bell. Wasn’t it Platini that blamed the united fans in Lens when trouble was started by the police who refused genuine fans with tickets entry. Then crammed them into one area. Then to deflect the blame started crying about the free kick that only platini and the French thought should not have stood.
Then there was the trouble in Rome when the police attacked the united fans when you could clearly see the Roma fans insight a riot.
I could go on Leeds fans stab and killed in Turkey. A Liverpool fan jailed for a murder that so far he has been proven innocent. United fans jailed for 3 months in Dortmund not for football violence but drinking in a beer tent. After 3 months the case was thrown out and fans were allowed to go home.
Okay so Liverpool lost but what really winds me up is the smug smile on that French tw*t platinis face. He as like all of Uefa hates everything about England. The way we can organise successful sporting events and the way all English fans support their teams with pride.
Uefa should realise without the English teams the European competitions are on par with the Carling Cup. Because after all there is probably 14 top teams in Europe and for the last 3 years 4 of them have been English.
I believe the time has come for our government to concentrate on how there citizens are being dealt with when we go abroad instead of spending f*ckin fortunes in Iraq.
Although there has been much said about Police abroad may I remind our Liverpool Friends that due to crowds barging there way into grounds there has been very serious and deadly consequenses. Thee forged tickets were sold by scousers so you have scousers ripping off scousers - Classic. I think that the only way around this is to make a final two legged with tickets only being available to home fans thereby everyone should be able to see the final without any fuss. Ask yourselfs this WHY IS IT ALLWAYS LIVERPOOL.
I agree with you, the(bmx)bandit. But, as someone else said, that Liverpool fan was found guilty of Attempted murder - not innocent of murder (he might be either, but how do we know?), and as it's really just a case of an individual getting into mischief rather than the whole tarring with the same brush that UEFA and foreign police forces are doing with english fans.
I'm not bothered who these fans support, they deserve to be treated as human beings and with respect, just as the foreign fans are treated when they come here. Why is it that we learned lessons from our mistakes and tragedies and implemented (largely) succesful measures to counter them, but Europe does not follow suit? If anything, hooliganism in Italy and France is getting worse, yet you never hear any critisism or mention of sanctions against them by the UEFA bigwigs.
- 1 Reply to Tim
In answer to thorpedoderoma, just look at the way the police (or security or whatever they were) in Rome dealt with the fans. That is not an intelligent approach.
The Italian approach seems to be "step out of line and we'll beat the sh*t out of you and then you won´t do it again". Perhaps it works. Or perhaps that approach was a catalyst to the Italian policeman being killed this year. What happened in Rome was the police saying "go on, do it, give me an opportunity to hit you". The fans should have behaved, of course, but some people don´t.
In Britain we accept there are trouble makers and we control them. There are the same people with the same tendancy to cause trouble but we deal with it better - more intelligently, more civilised. We diffuse the touble and calm the situation before it starts. That's the intelligent approach. My brother-in-law is a policeman in the UK. He said if what happened in Rome happened in the UK the officers would be identified from the video and suspended. In the UK the police are allowed to use "reasonable force" which means once the hooligan is on the floor or even just holding his hands up you stop. The police are there to control the crowds not to issue the punishment. In Italy the police act as judge, jury and executioner; they issue the punishment there and then. And then the politicians say they did a good job! I'm sorry if you are offended but that is just not an intelligent, civilised society. Your police control crowds by fear.
Ask youself why there is never any trouble at English grounds for European matches or why there was no trouble for the FA Cup Final.
In Greece it is obvious that having a load of people unable to get in the ground would lead to these people getting angry. I suppose you think they should have all said "oh nevermind, let's go home". That's not going to happen and the authorities need to deal with it. Believe if that had been in the UK that trouble would not have happened.
- 1 Reply to Stash
Is this just an anty Liverpool board.
Firstly I was in the World Cup in France when you all would have seen the TV pictures showing full on rioting every where England went. Trust me it was nothing like that.
I remember a picture that appeared in the Sun newspaper the day of the Romania game in Toulousse it had an English fan with the name P*ss Head and a No 1 underneath. This was a 55 year old with his wife who had bought it him as a joke.
Underneath the picture in the sun was "English Hooligans out again".
So if you believe everything the TV cameras portray then you would say that the treatment United fans received in Lens and Roma were justified.
I am not a Liverpool fan just someone who I thought could get involved in a good discussion on a message board.
Clearly I am wasting my time. I need to hate Liverpool to try and string a discussion together.
The trouble in Roma showed that they have no idea how to deal with fans. It's almost like they expect all English football fans to be hooligans and so plan to act like riot police. We all know that there are usually
1 decent fans who want to watch a game,
2 rowdy yobs who might be noisy and drunk but harmless
3 hooligans who just want to make trouble
In England we deal with it intelligently. At the Man Utd Roma match (in Manchester) there were reports of some trouble outside the ground and the media reported what the police did with words like "calmed", "contained", "diffused". No one was "beaten" or "bloodied" or "in hospital". We have a different way of dealing with crowds. It's no just us, it all of northern Europe. You don´t find Italian police tactics in Holland or Sweden or Germany. We are just more intelligent and organised than they are.
- 2 Replies to Norman W
"We are just more intelligent and organised than they are."
how can an apparently (apparently I guess) normal guy can say bullshit like that (you're such a big idiot... and now maybe will you talk about the superiority of nordic and anglosaxon people????)
the fact is that you (in england) you made a good work with your hooligans but only on your ground... when a game is abroad you're dealing with the problem of hooligans again... because you can't control who's leaving the country for seeing a game like you're controlling who's entering your stadiums...
i don't find that german or english people are more intelligent than others... escuse me but i call it racism