Tottenham Hotspur Message Board
How many wrong decisions can one ref make in a game? Adam shouldn't be on the park, 1st penalty wasn't, push on Dawson 2nd pen looks like the player played for and conned the ref. Yet another crap for a Spurs game !!
well we lost again so no suprises there.
probably a good thing in terms of missing out on a europa league place & also city have a slim chance of pipping the gooners to 3rd.
at the end of the day, whatever excuses we make for harry/levy they ended up buying another midfielder (sp) & were a few mins late in buying another attacking midfielder (charlie adam)!
what planet are they are on!
it was clear a goalscorer, CB & competition with ekotto were needed! yet they ignored all these things.
this squad & team had 5th or 6th written all over it.
the scary thing is i can just see harry buying joe cole, a player we dont need & who is not actually very good or better than we have. & yet again ignoring the areas we need improving in.
I agree John. The balance of the squad is not right in two ways IMO. Because we have been keeping our fingers crossed that King and Woodgate would be back we have bought cover for that position ahead of others that needed it (Strikers!) but also we didn't buy expensive quality and instead bought cheap (Bassong) which, in the long term, has not done us any favours.
The other balance issue, and it is becoming more of a topic for discuission now that he has lost his goal scoring touch, is how you fit VDV in and still keep the balance and shape of the team capable of beating PL sides.
At least no one can argue that we don't have enough MF cover!!!!
As for Pool losing last night......let's hope at least one of your wishes comes true tonight. On that though, I am not sure about 5th and Europa football. Whilst I would love to beat Citeh I am not sure if it would be better to lose which is an awful thing to be contemplating but there we are. If of course beating Citeh could guarantee us 4th then thats a different matter altogether.
Sorry, that list is the 21yr old + - and its from Feb - so by then Keane, Bentley, Dos Santos et al (whoever he is) had been loaned (and presumably not expected back). I'm not sure what happens with named squads if you then have to call back someone from loan who isn't in the sqaud. Under 21 - I would assume to be ok - so Walker could have been called back (I think, and assuming the loan allowed it), as you appear to be able to have as many U21 as you like.
I think 'arrys thought (and this is me projecting) is the LB is covered by BAE/Bale - RB Hutton/Corluka (and as we've now seen, Gallas and Kaboul).
The squad is over (IMHO) at the back and imbalance within there - as you rightly point out. If we could drop 2-4 from the back (or at least re-shuffle - ie sell and buy in) then to me I'd go for Johnson at RM, a new CF (presumably British to keep the balance) and I'd like a 'calm' keeper and maybe a LB to cover. That is on the assumption that Khumbalo or perm any 3 from 4, can partner Daws at CB.
I still don't see how 'arry is going to get VdV to fit. RM obviously had problems, hence the fact he didn't play that much and the 'silly' price. There's no doubt that he's gifted, but like Balotelli - what good is talent if you don't know how to apply it?
I think 'arry can take us to the next stage - as with a half dozen or so more goals this season, and assuming they took the stupid amount of draws into wins, we'd be all but guaranteed 4th already. That's how fine the lines are. I don't think anyone would have predicted all our strikers failing at the same time. All three are capable of 12-15 goals each per season.
Look at the table - and our amount of losses this season - we're right up there with the likes of UTD. We're 5 better than Pool, 2 better than Citeh, 1 better than the Chavs - that's obviously with 3 games to go though! Tooooooooooo many bloody draws.
I'm not sure I want us to get 5th (if we don't get 4th ;-)!) - but I hope the Pool get stuffed tonight and we stuff Citeh tomorrow.
Joe - I agree although I think Defoe is good enough but only if he has another big striker to play off (Not Crouch or Pav).
John, Of the 10 defenders there is only one recognised LB (BAE) and one RB (Hutton as I think Corluka was bought as a CB) so that leaves 8 CB's BUT, and I think you are thinking along the same lines here, King and Woodgate should not be part of that squad. 4 CB's should be enough with an extra couple of FB's that could play CB in an emergency. A La O'Shea covering Vidic, Ferdinand, Smalling and Evans.
And, the squad you have listed does not include obvious people such as Keane, O'Hara, Bentley, Walker, Townsend, Noughton, Dos Santos or even Danny Rose. 3 of those are MF's and there are probably more if I could be bothered to think about it.
Oh, and your list does not even include Bale!!
My point was, given our injury problems that everybody including Arry knew about, why did we buy yet more MF's and not more defensive cover? We have CB's playing FB although I have to say, I thought Danny Rose did a great job so perhaps we have found cover for BAE by accident.
I am not a big one for sentiment in these things so King and Woodgate would be out so that we could strengthen the squad with better players than Bassong.
4 Keepers?? Why?? But its up front that we are weakest. Not only in numbers but in class as well. As I said at the start of this, I do think Defoe can score goals but only if he has a partner who can take the load. But by trying to fit the nomad VDV in Defoe cannot play. That leaves us with either Crouch or Pav and THAT is where it all goes wrong for me.
Did you notice Arry screaming at Sandro to get back and stay in front of the back 4?? Why, if he has selected VDV to partner a striker, do we not see him as animated in trying to get VDV out of defence and up front where he bl00dy well should be??
Surely two players in each position is cover enough? That gives a min squad of 22. The base 25 man squad as at Feb was:
1 Assou-Ekotto, Benoit No
2 Bassong Nguena, Sebastian Aymar No
3 Khumalo, Bongani No
4 Corluka, Vedran No
5 Crouch, Peter James Yes
6 Cudicini, Carlo No
7 Gomes, Heurelho Da Silva No
8 Dawson, Michael Richard Yes
9 Defoe, Jermain Colin Yes
10 Gallas, William No
11 Huddlestone, Thomas Andrew Yes
12 Hutton, Alan No
13 Jenas, Jermaine Anthony Yes
14 Kaboul, Younes No
15 Woodgate, Jonathan Simon Yes
16 King, Ledley Brenton Yes
17 Kranjcar, Niko No
18 Lennon, Aaron Yes
19 Modric, Luka No
20 Pienaar, Steven No
21 Alnwick, Ben Robert Yes
22 Palacios Suazo, Wilson Roberto No
23 Pavlyuchenko, Roman No
24 Pletikosa, Stipe No
25 Van Der Vaart, Rafael No
(Aren't all of those full Internationals as well?)
So what - 4 keepers, 10 defenders (7 CBs?), 8 midfielders (includinbg VdV as I don't know what else to class him as!), and 3 strikers (or 4 strikers and 7 midfield).
So the balance looks more in favour of defence than midfield - maybe as 'arry had to compensate for King and Woodgate.
I think you'll find that it was (maybe still is) a simple policy. They tended to buy in young talent, then see if something could be made of them internally - and if not try to sell them on at a profit.
Do you remember the hype about Blondel as well? And even Postiga could be seen in that vein.
I don't recall too many that Spurs let go who became superstars elsewhere (at the same level - so I'm discounting Taraabt until he cam show the same form for a couple of seasons in the EPL).
Maybe Souness....? Any others?
So I would guess that sofar, the judgement of 'who will make it' has been pretty good on that front.
I agree with the vast majority of that thread, my comment on Pav is that I don't really see him as any better or worse than the other two excuses of front men.
Agreed that Harry/Levy pissed about in January when everyone knew what we needed to do to strengthen.
VDV isn't disciplined enough, but his potential is huge. I think he can be played off the striker if we have the right striker! and I have no idea who that would be!
I'm trying to stay positive, our CL run was an amazing experience and we progressed to a level that I had only dreamt of. Hopefully we can learn alot from that expeience and ensure we are back their before too long.
My biggest fear is that Harry has taken us as far as he can!
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have never been sure about Pav but that game made up my mind.
Danny Rose had a great game IMO. Looked comfortable, got forward well and was much better than I thought he would be.
Once again its down to missed chances and the need for a top class striker is more evident than ever. Kaboul looked slow both going forward and covering at the back. Useless crosses and no real link up play.
Sandro did well again but VDV looked off the pace - again.
As the Ref did nothing about Adam's evil challenge does that mean the FA can look at it again and meat out some retrospective punishment? That said, I think they will only do that if Spurs make a complaint and Arry is being so bl00dy laid back about everything lately I can't see that happening.
Another poor display and another game where the tactics (playing VDV off the striker) did not work.
Well, After last week it's not a surprise.
3 goals that shouldn't and our 2 goals that should. 2 Wins that should be if Officiating crew did the job right,
Charlie adams is low life. On tv and didn't have the class to start by saying he was sorry for maiming bale with a naff challenge! No class. No character. I hope he gets a similar challenge and the same result.
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To add, The Premier league should Follow American football and penalise players for cheating and Bad fouls by fines and bans on evidence after the game.
I remember Robbie Fowler once telling the ref that he hadn't been fouled. Blackpool lack the class and are desperate for the points by any means. If the players knew they;d be banned or team docked points. It would stop!
Why are we surprised again!!!!!!!!!
Firstly Gomes is a joker - Cudicini should be playing.
Secondly Danny Rose isn't good enough when we need a result, why Krankjar isn't playing is beyond me.
Taking off Pav (even though he's rubbish and playing with 1 striker!)
And Defoe and Pav are terrible. Both need sold.
I'd give HR the summer to sort the team or I'm afraid he has to go. Our blatant arrogance has ruined our season.
Terrible team - prima donna players - I'm sure Modders, VdV and Bale have one eye on a move away.
HR has turned the corner in my eyes. No wins in 12 says it all. We may even end up 7th. Frankly we deserve it.
- 1 Reply to Jonny P
How can you say Danny Rose isn't good enough? Time and time again he got us out of trouble while playing in an unfamiliar position. He linked up well with Bale down the left flank too.
The penalty incidents were farcical - Daws was clearly pushed so the first one should never have been given thus they'd never have got a sniff at the second one. In any case Charlie Adam shouldn't have been on the pitch after his horrendous tackle on Bale. From what 'Arry was saying post-match I'd doubt he'll play again this season.
However, what did for us was a raft of missed chances early in the second half. Even if one had been put away it'd have given us more confidence. MOTD didn't show the Defoe disallowed goal - was he offside?
I have no idea why 'Arry didn't put Kranjcar on when Bale went off - surely a cast iron reason to make a like-for-like change to capitalise down the left. Pavy was awful - missing easy balls and chances and going down like a sack of potatoes at every innocuous challenge. I've been a supporter of his for a long while now but feel he's got to go.
Sandro continues to be a revelation. You could see he was itching to get forward but had obviously taken on board 'Arry's warnings to stay back and help defend. vdV didn't have a particularly brilliant game and I wasn't surprised when he was subbed.
The ref was again appalling. Blatant fouls on our boys went unpunished - he always seemed to be looking the wrong way; and what does Crouch have to do to get a decision going his way when close to or in the oppo's box? Shirt tugging, knocked over - he seems to be targeted all the time.
All in all very disappointed we didn't take all 3 points, especially when Citeh had lost earlier in the afternoon. The only bright spot was that it didn't rain while we were walking back down the High Road.