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  • jonathan jonathan Sep 17, 2007 21:15 Flag

    Appalling Evidence for all you McLaren fans


    This makes me want to puke:


    FIA's details of what truly went on at McLaren this year.

    What a load of garbage....how can Hamilton say his win won't be tainted by this? LH and FA dont deserve half a point...
    I thought it was just about the passing of a 780pages document...well, go and read and you'll see how the whole team was involved in the use of Ferrari information.
    Good luck defending what's on there....

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    • Very interesting stuff...............

      1) It states that the FIA considered McLaren to have a sporting advantage...............therefore IF that was the case and that is why the team were disqualified for 2007 - then surely the drivers had the advantage too??

      2) McLaren state that they HAD the information but didn't use it - fair enough. BUT they did have knowledge of how the Ferrari worked.

      3) Higher people in McLaren KNEW Coughlan was getting this information - why didn't they blow the whistle to the FIA there and then?? They tried to stop Coughlan meeting up with Stepney - big deal, they SHOULD have alerted both the FIA AND Ferrari. They didn't.

      4) The 'dossier' Coughlan had seems to be basically a very detailed insight into the workings of the 2007 Ferrari - why don't, as part of the punishment, the FIA make McLaren give a similar 'dossier' to Ferrari??

      This whole episode still sinks and to be honest has totally ruined F1's reputation and it is going to take years for the sport to recover from it - if it ever does. IF McLaren didn't use the information this year, whats to say it didn't give them ideas for 2008??

      What is difficult is that if Stepney had gone to work at McLaren with the knowledge in his head, this situation would never have arisen. Gascoigne going to Toyota and Spyker, Newey going to McLaren and Red Bull - both would have taken knowledge and experience from previous teams.

      Both Stepney and Coughlan should be banned from working at this level for life - how can either be trusted? How much information had Stepney passed that went undetected?

      The 2007 drivers title is tainted - no question - but that wont stop the 'tourist' f1 fans bowing and kissing Hamiltons feet proclaiming him the new champion - a feat that shouldn't be underestimated - but to the true F1 fan, 2007 will ALWAYS be clouded in this spy saga.

      Sorry but I can't wait for this season to finish and all the Hamilton-fuore go away.........

      • 2 Replies to B2a
      • Quite right!!!
        Only those drivers in cars without a sporting advantage should be eligible to compete for the drivers' championship.
        (... rules out quite a few of the so called 'legends' though)!

      • I totally agree with you... how can they let the drivers off the hook??? they [potentially] used Ferrari technical & strategic info since the beginning of the year...
        This is the only way they can beat Ferrari... they tried changing the rules to disadvantage Ferrari [one set of tires per race - one engine per 2 weekends] and they tried standardizing the cars [to stymie development & innovation, a Ferrari forte] and they reduced the time for testing...
        I think there's a conspiracy going on between the F1 [Ecclestone] and the McClaren team to disadvantage Ferrari in favor of McClaren [a British team with a British driver - Hamilton]... that's also why McClaren favors Hamilton over Alonso...
        This is nothing less than cheating and fixing races and has a definite tinge of racism...
        I hope the McClaren/Mercedes gets kicked out of F1 forever and I hope Ferrari wins their civil lawsuits against them...

    • Conspiracy theorists unite. How about this for a scenario:

      Racing team realizes they are going to loose the championship, set up the current leaders with the ‘help’ (unwitting or otherwise) of possibly the dumbest cluster #$%$ on the planet who works for the team that is in the lead by deliberately sending him #$%$ documents to spike the wheel of the other team? Sounds a bit off the wall right? Well, think of it this way…………….mission accomplished…..$100 million fine and points stripped. Good day at the office I would say.

      Me thinks someone needs to keep track of a certain driver’s bank accounts and a couple of chaps who like to send documents to each other via email and see who gained what.

      Just a thought. To this date no one knows who killed Kennedy in Dallas; but it’s obvious the loan gunman in the book depository didn’t do it alone!!!! Look at who gains most and who had the power to do it…………..usually it will give you the clues you need.

      Hey, next season why not every team send out documents to the opposition; saves the trouble of actually earning the points!

      If it looks like, smells like, and feels like #$%$…….it usually is! Doh.

      • 1 Reply to Conspiracy Theorist
      • Nice post, mate
        But presidents dont get shot every day...in F1 though, spying goes on every day

        Teams take pictures of their competitor's cars, they try to figure their strategies, etc

        This time, though, one team got real #$%$ off cos it all happened during the season and it took massive proportions

        One guy calls his mate next door during the race to let him know of Ferrari's pit stop strategy? straight like that?
        Hundreds of txt messages? email communications non-stop during the season... i think enough is enough and ferrari was right to get the police involved, to get to the bottom of the matter...

        So although we'll never know about Kennedy's death, and you can bring all the conspiracy theories you want, but here we have enough facts...
        Thats just my opinion though...

    • Poor Peter getting his knickers in a twist and calling people #$%$, personally I think people who cheat and lie are #$%$. But I guess its been a very frustring time for the McLaren bigots. They have had to suffer season after season of mediocrity. One of the excuses they can think of for this mediocrity is to accuse others of cheating, then all of a sudden there is light at the end of the very long tunnel and just as it seems they might win something it's discovered they have cheated and lied. Imagine the frustration at McLaren bigot central right now. Most balanced people will consider anything they do this season tainted. Perhaps more frustrating for the McLaren bigot is that since their team is now guilty of cheating it can't be used as an excuse against other teams. I hope McLaren do well next year and hopefully they will do it honestly.

    • yup,but Mosley didn't suggest sharing of the tech info...right? or they're all stupid to agree...

    • you're one angry,furious soul in this message board!!cool down you'll get heartattack in defending anyone..but if something happens to you,would they care that you got heart attack defending them...i don't think so...

    • But there are times when the teams have the power to prevent certain transmissions from being heard. They wouldn't let a radio transmission to be heard if it involved pit strategy or any other strategy that could compromise themselves.

    • I think you will find that all the teams listern to each others radio transmissions. The FIA made them all open thats when you watch the grand prix on the telly you get to hear some of the radio conversations

    • Interesting....you said that KR listened to Ferrari radio when he was at McLaren? If KR were to be punished it would be as a driver of McLaren and not Ferrari. It seems that cheating has been going on much longer than initially thought over at team McLaren! Thank you for enlightening us all to that fact! Choke on that one Peter, and don't forget...you said it!!!

    • Unbeleivable, how many Ferarri #$%$ are on this page. Even big Max says they MAY have benefited. Glad he doesn't wear a white wig in a court in Britain, he would hang you first then ask questions later. Ron Dennis has told them time and time again, feel free to check the cars. I don't care how many people have read this document., check the cars. KR says they used to listen to Ferrari radio when he was at Mclaren, if so why has he escaped punishment, oops sorry he's at Ferrari now. I'll bet he hasn't told anything to Ferrari about his time at Mclaren, (bull). Mclaren should appeal. Ferrari did nothing but cheat with MS. and don't dare argue over him, all the cheating is on film, and whats the worst he got, considering he could easily have killed someone. naff all, why he drove Ferrari.

    • Toatlly agree with your comment about lh.Perhaps he had his rose tinted glasses on when he made that comment.Will be glad to see next years championship seeing as this one is so tainted.Amazes me how the drivers were not also docked points as they would have been the ones who ultimately benefited from any information.Strange one that.

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