• Liverpool Message Board

  • navysealsrule navysealsrule Sep 7, 2007 17:55 Flag

    if you were gerrard

    if you were steven gerrard would you play with a broken toe or would you just say no ?...........a lot of people claim the final decision is down to mclaren this is wrong from a human rights perspective ......should the decision to play or not to play be down to the player himself?.......surely the final decision lays with stevie g not mcalren or benetiz...on a personal note i am glad he won,t be playing.................


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    • just to add to this post i picked up someone saying players do not get paid for internationals ...........they do all players get appearence money and travel allowance from there home ground to wembley the appearence money is a very nominal fee and all players get the same amount regardless of who they are


      • 2 Replies to navysealsrule
      • I think I mentioned, not on this thread, but a related one on the same subject, that the player is paid by the club, but more importantly its the club who holds his contract, so I assumed would have the final say.

        However it was pointed out to me by our resident blue on the board, that since McClaren gets his authority from the FA, and the FA hold the players registration and therefore right to play, that the England manager has a trump card. A nuclear option granted, but still the ultimate power.

        I questioned if its ever come to that, and I don't know if we got a full answer from anyone yet. Also, I'm not sure how this works out if it was ever challenged under employment law, as to me, this is a trade association (FA) basically black balling, or threatening to black ball, and independent contractor (the player).

        Not sure if you have any insight, as it seems you may know more about the FA working relationships between players and clubs, better than me?

      • players get bonuses if certain objectives are met, being a championship, a game, or whatever the pertinent authorities decide

    • I know when i broke my toe, it hurt like a bastard most of the time, whether I was playing footie or not (you just can't keep me off that pitch). I just hope these internationals do not affect his Liverpool contribution.

    • I, personally, would like to see McClaren gone.
      I think he only got the job because he was once Assistant Manager at United.
      Getting 'Boro to a Uefa Cup final and winning the carling cup are his only accomplishments... hardly a World Class pedigree.
      Sven was a better manager but he had to go, because of things that happened in his private life, but his win/loss record in competitive games for England was outstanding.
      We should have replaced him with one of the best coaches in the World but we were too eager to employ someone by basis of nationality... I say give him the boot and replace him with Mourinho, Scolari or Hiddink.

      • 1 Reply to A Yahoo! User
      • If we had to go with an English manager, Alydice would have been my first choice. When he quit Bolton I thought it might happen, but now he's set up shop in Newcastle, I don't see it happening.

        For foreign managers, I'd go with Scolari. Think he commented once about the possibility in the future would intrest him.

        Even if we do win the next two matches, and do qualify, I still think the FA needs to seriously look at whether McClaren is the right person going forward. He might be a nice bloke, but he's not the top tier manager we need to push the squad.

    • I don't think Israel will be an 'easy' match as such, it's gonna be a tricky one.
      I think McClaren knows if he loses these matches; he's gone. So I think he'll use any means possible to win them even if that means risking Stevie's fitness.

      • 2 Replies to A Yahoo! User
      • exactly, too much at stake for mcclaren

        however, most people are missing the importance of the injury: a broken toe is a broken toe!

        to play football you need to use your toes my friends.

      • I agree with you the Saturday will not be easy. I'm sure Israel will be looking for a result, and will be as cagy as possible in shutting England down. But, I still think its the easier of the two fixtures.

        On your second point, this is a bit disturbing. If McClaren is willing to risk Stevie, or anyone else (Hargreives is also doubtful right now) to save his own job, then he should no longer be the England Coach (although that's just one reason among many to bag this guy). Sure we want results, but any coach who does not put his players first, will loose the respect of those players. Once that's happened, you are no longer effective. This is about what is best for English Football, not Steve McClaren.

    • Theres a report in the paper today saying Gerrard will be playing on saturday WITHOUT a pain killing injection. I can't say how accurate the report is though.

    • Human rights? You're having a laugh mate.....

      Do you seriously think McLaren would make a decision that was against the wishes of the player? And even if he did, there is still no way he can physically force the player to walk out onto the pitch. This isn't the dark ages anymore.

      Of course the decision rests with the player, first and foremost. He must be given whatever medical advice is needed to make an OBJECTIVE decision on his fitness and ability to play. If, off the back of that, he decides to go against the wishes of his club and make himself available, then the club has no leg to stand on IMO.

      Stevie DESPERATELY wants to represent his country, which is admirable. It has to be his call as to whether he decides to take on the risks of playing on his own body. The club can piss and moan about it, but they can't force him to do anything. Nor can McLaren.

      • 1 Reply to Anyone But United
      • Abu, we have to be careful with this one regarding who can or can't decide. It should be a good relationship between club and country with a little give and take on both sides but alas that doesn't seem to be the case between Benitez and McClaren. It's easy to understand why both sides take a stance but in this case I do believe risking long term injury for the sake of a game against Israel which we should win hands down is a bit silly. If McClaren isn't careful it will end up where contracts are drawn up stating that players must put club before country and we really don't want to go down that road I suspect. No matter what anyone says it is and probably always will be a players club who pays his wages.